Time to resume after a short break. The Southern campaigns is now kicking into full gear. It's a little odd how long this whole story-line is (5 chapters in novel, 4 and a half volumes in this manga), considering the Nanman tribes are barely mentioned, much less play a role, before and after this arc. In comparison, the hugely important Red Cliffs story-line is 7 chapters long in the novel and 3 volumes long in the manga (counting from Zhuge Liang's arrival to Wu until Guan Yu letting Cao Cao escape). As such, it might feel like a "filler arc," in the loose sense of that word, but it's still an entertaining campaign nonetheless as the exotic southern locale brings surprises unlike any in the story so far. I hope you have fun reading it.
*VOLUME 46 NOW COMPLETE. I'm also going to take a short break and start v47 in June. Download Sangokushi v46: Mediafire; Mega Sangokushi c318: Sendspace
With the Arslan anime currently airing, you might notice that the prisoner releasing trick to split apart enemy alliances is a ruse also present in RotK, though quite a bit more elaborate here. Since Tanaka's a pretty big fan of Chinese history, I wouldn't be surprised if he got the idea from it.
Cunning alone isn't enough if your acting skills aren't up to par.
This throne room looks almost hilariously stereotypical.
Zhao Zilong's been portrayed as a very calm-headed man so far, but even he has his moments of excessive pride and confidence. Also, if you've read the Brewitt-Taylor translation, it's not supposed to be Ma Zheng, it's Ma Zhong.
An almost loony toon-esque moment.
Man, imagine if you were one of the soldiers who died during all these battles to capture enemy leaders only to have your commander release them.
As much as I like this arc, 4 and a half volumes for 4 and a half chapters sounds really weird, especially considering it's usually discarded altogether. Using the same ratio for everything else we would have had 120 volumes instead of 60, and important stuff like Guandu and the Wei conquest of the north wouldn't have been skipped. I guess the serialization has been very long and Yokoyama couldn't plan everything in detail, but still, 60 volumes don't seem a lot anymore. I hope the post-Wuzhang won't get butchered too much (there are still something like 30 chapters after the Southern Campaign...).
>4 and a half volumes for 4 and a half chapters sounds really weird
I guess Yokoyama, like you and I, was a fan of this arc. If you actually read the original novel's chapters of the Southern campaigns, you'll find that some of these battles are rather scant on the details. A good example are the battles I just translated in chapters 311 and 312. In the novel, it's just a couple sentences saying Wei Yan did this and that to overcome the enemies. In the manga, however, Yokoyama adds a lot more scenes portraying both sides and a clearer version of the events. You can see for yourself here: http://www.threekingdoms.com/087.htm
>post-Wuzhang won't get butchered too much
Yoshikawa Eiji had this view that RotK was a story about great heroes and as such, to begin with Liu Bei and end with Zhuge Liang, the last great hero, was satisfactory (I guess he didn't think all that highly of Sima Yi...). He also thought that the original novel was too anticlimactic in its events post-Zhuge Liang's death so his 10-volume translation stops with Zhuge Liang's death. He did, however, add a brief epilogue where he gives a quick rundown of events from post-Wuzhang to the Jin unification.
Yokoyama's Sangokushi, which is adapting Yoshikawa's Sangokushi and not LGZ's original, takes a somewhat similar path but instead of ending with Zhuge Liang's death, he ends with the fall of Shu. This may seem unsatisfactory, and although I do share the sentiment, even the original novel covers the 23 years of post-Shu to Jin in just 2 and a half chapters.
It is interesting to think that an adaptation of a novel famous for its theme of the rise and decline of all things including empires would omit the ultimate unification of the realm but what not many people realize is even the famous opening line of RotK, "The empire, long divided, must unite; long united, must divide," is actually something inserted for Mao father & son's recension.
I really like your scans Tomorrow's Joe.Thanks for completing it.There is also a manga that I like which I thought you may consider Its name is Rokudenashi Blues.It is manga with great tale I hope you consider it.Thanks for your releases
I was really surprised with Zhao Zilong, after 300 chapters of near perfection, then that happened, but i guess that it also counts as perfection since it was Kongming's plan
When in doubt, always assume it's Kongming's plan. But this isn't the only time where he's egged on by his great sense of pride. I think a similar instance happens later during Northern campaign against Wei when he gets all offended about being too old.
I think the book's constant overstatement and over-exaggeration of Kongming's strategies and characters somewhat ruined it for me - in my opinion this is a perfect series/manga/book but to go as far as portraying Kongming as a god who can predict everything and pretty much win every war is just too far-fetched and makes it look silly.
True, it's just one of those things you either like or dislike. Either you like seeing Kongming's antics and go along with the ride, or you get annoyed by how much better Kongming is compared to the rest. Still, it should be noted that Kongming's endeavour ultimately failed, so he does come up short in the story (though whether or not that was actually his fault up for discussion).
While being pioneering in the genre, Yokoyama's Water Margin doesn't look like a great adaptation, it's only 8 volumes long too (the novel is 3K-huge). Hox said he was interested in doing the Yokoyama's manga about Liu Bang and Xiang Yu and Hyouge Mono after Sangokushi, but I don't know if those are still his plan. Either way they are two great historical series.
Like the guy above me said, Yokoyama's Water Margin is a highly condensed version that ends pretty abruptly. It's also aimed at a slightly younger audience than Sangokushi and thus more simplified.
It is a significant work nonetheless as it was Yokoyama's first try at a Chinese history-themed story. Prior to this, very few mangaka, if not none at all, had actually attempted to turn Chinese stories into mangaka, so he had no idea how it'd fare in a shonen magazine. The success of Suikoden is what spurred Yokoyama onto do more tales from Chinese history, including his most famous one, Sangokushi. Also, for anybody interested in Yokoyama's art evolution, Suikoden is a MUST-READ, as it starts off TEZUKA AS FUCK and by the end, becomes indistinguishable from the Sangokushi art.
I did plan to do the Xiang Yu story after Sangokushi, but I'm now rethinking it. I'm currently more leaning towards Shiji instead, as it's not a continual narrative that would require a lot of focus, so I can do another manga series alongside it.
this is too bad! I tried my best to search for even a single page of manga for Water Margin, but could find none. I personally cannot even dream of a manga as mature, sophisticated and elegant as Three Kingdoms. It complements the novel so well and I think the actual novel is nowhere as entertaining without the manga.
As much as I like this arc, 4 and a half volumes for 4 and a half chapters sounds really weird, especially considering it's usually discarded altogether.
ReplyDeleteUsing the same ratio for everything else we would have had 120 volumes instead of 60, and important stuff like Guandu and the Wei conquest of the north wouldn't have been skipped.
I guess the serialization has been very long and Yokoyama couldn't plan everything in detail, but still, 60 volumes don't seem a lot anymore.
I hope the post-Wuzhang won't get butchered too much (there are still something like 30 chapters after the Southern Campaign...).
>4 and a half volumes for 4 and a half chapters sounds really weird
DeleteI guess Yokoyama, like you and I, was a fan of this arc. If you actually read the original novel's chapters of the Southern campaigns, you'll find that some of these battles are rather scant on the details. A good example are the battles I just translated in chapters 311 and 312. In the novel, it's just a couple sentences saying Wei Yan did this and that to overcome the enemies. In the manga, however, Yokoyama adds a lot more scenes portraying both sides and a clearer version of the events. You can see for yourself here: http://www.threekingdoms.com/087.htm
>post-Wuzhang won't get butchered too much
Yoshikawa Eiji had this view that RotK was a story about great heroes and as such, to begin with Liu Bei and end with Zhuge Liang, the last great hero, was satisfactory (I guess he didn't think all that highly of Sima Yi...). He also thought that the original novel was too anticlimactic in its events post-Zhuge Liang's death so his 10-volume translation stops with Zhuge Liang's death. He did, however, add a brief epilogue where he gives a quick rundown of events from post-Wuzhang to the Jin unification.
Yokoyama's Sangokushi, which is adapting Yoshikawa's Sangokushi and not LGZ's original, takes a somewhat similar path but instead of ending with Zhuge Liang's death, he ends with the fall of Shu. This may seem unsatisfactory, and although I do share the sentiment, even the original novel covers the 23 years of post-Shu to Jin in just 2 and a half chapters.
It is interesting to think that an adaptation of a novel famous for its theme of the rise and decline of all things including empires would omit the ultimate unification of the realm but what not many people realize is even the famous opening line of RotK, "The empire, long divided, must unite; long united, must divide," is actually something inserted for Mao father & son's recension.
Don't usually like older manga but i'm 1 volume through on this and enjoying it.
ReplyDeleteHope you stick with it! The story gets much bigger and interesting as it progresses.
DeleteI'm planning to. To be honest, the number of volumes is a bit intimidating but the 1 i have read so far was entertaining and fast paced.
Deletejust as the saying " a picture says 1000 words " goes, this manga has already made the original novel much smaller.
DeleteLmao! 2 Kongming!!1
ReplyDeleteI really like your scans Tomorrow's Joe.Thanks for completing it.There is also a manga that I like which I thought you may consider Its name is Rokudenashi Blues.It is manga with great tale I hope you consider it.Thanks for your releases
ReplyDeleteI was really surprised with Zhao Zilong, after 300 chapters of near perfection, then that happened, but i guess that it also counts as perfection since it was Kongming's plan
ReplyDeleteWhen in doubt, always assume it's Kongming's plan. But this isn't the only time where he's egged on by his great sense of pride. I think a similar instance happens later during Northern campaign against Wei when he gets all offended about being too old.
DeleteI think the book's constant overstatement and over-exaggeration of Kongming's strategies and characters somewhat ruined it for me - in my opinion this is a perfect series/manga/book but to go as far as portraying Kongming as a god who can predict everything and pretty much win every war is just too far-fetched and makes it look silly.
DeleteTrue, it's just one of those things you either like or dislike. Either you like seeing Kongming's antics and go along with the ride, or you get annoyed by how much better Kongming is compared to the rest. Still, it should be noted that Kongming's endeavour ultimately failed, so he does come up short in the story (though whether or not that was actually his fault up for discussion).
DeleteWould you like some help with these series?
ReplyDelete(blanking/a little bit of cleaning)
Thanks but no extra help is needed.
DeleteOk ^_^
DeleteWait HOX, are you saying that you'll be moving onto Water Margin by Yokoyama once this series is finished??? THANKS!
ReplyDeleteNo, I never said that.
DeleteHaha, okay fine. But seriously given how great this one is, wouldn't you say Water Margin would be the same too??
ReplyDeleteWhile being pioneering in the genre, Yokoyama's Water Margin doesn't look like a great adaptation, it's only 8 volumes long too (the novel is 3K-huge).
DeleteHox said he was interested in doing the Yokoyama's manga about Liu Bang and Xiang Yu and Hyouge Mono after Sangokushi, but I don't know if those are still his plan.
Either way they are two great historical series.
Like the guy above me said, Yokoyama's Water Margin is a highly condensed version that ends pretty abruptly. It's also aimed at a slightly younger audience than Sangokushi and thus more simplified.
DeleteIt is a significant work nonetheless as it was Yokoyama's first try at a Chinese history-themed story. Prior to this, very few mangaka, if not none at all, had actually attempted to turn Chinese stories into mangaka, so he had no idea how it'd fare in a shonen magazine. The success of Suikoden is what spurred Yokoyama onto do more tales from Chinese history, including his most famous one, Sangokushi. Also, for anybody interested in Yokoyama's art evolution, Suikoden is a MUST-READ, as it starts off TEZUKA AS FUCK and by the end, becomes indistinguishable from the Sangokushi art.
I did plan to do the Xiang Yu story after Sangokushi, but I'm now rethinking it. I'm currently more leaning towards Shiji instead, as it's not a continual narrative that would require a lot of focus, so I can do another manga series alongside it.
this is too bad! I tried my best to search for even a single page of manga for Water Margin, but could find none. I personally cannot even dream of a manga as mature, sophisticated and elegant as Three Kingdoms. It complements the novel so well and I think the actual novel is nowhere as entertaining without the manga.
DeleteI can send you the manga raws for Water margin if you really want to take a look. Just send me an email and I'll mail you the dl links.
DeleteWater Margin has been translated into French: http://www.bedetheque.com/serie-18479-BD-Au-bord-de-l-eau-Yokoyama.html
DeleteHi Hox, great job as always. Just one question, what is the status with Historie? Is it on break or something?
ReplyDeleteNot entirely sure. May have just been busy doing touch-up work for the recent v9 release in Japan.
Delete